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Post by sillierthings on Apr 13, 2015 15:00:25 GMT
I know other people have addressed this topic far more eloquently, but one of the major themes GRRM deals with is the nature and the evil of human bondage. The ways in which society and powerful individuals commodify human beings are many, but the end result is pretty much the same.
Dany's storyline covers this issue most explicitly, but it comes up in other story lines. Of course, I'm most interested in Sansa and Sandor--how both are commodities to be used and exploited by their masters and/or families. When Sandor flees, he's left without home, means of support, in danger of being dragged back and killed. The Brotherhood Without Banners are outlaws, unable to make money or have families or homes. If Sansa rejects the marriages being made for her, what options does she have?
So, any storylines of main characters, in my opinion, are not going to be resolved by having the "right" ruler on the Iron Throne, or in marrying the "right" kind of noble man. I don't think this is anything new that I'm saying, but more and more, it seems like the society of Westeros is going to go through some major upheaval, and while Dany's storyline shows us we can't just change things over night and expect it to be okay, on the other hand, just going back to the status quo isn't likely either.
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Post by katie on Apr 13, 2015 15:11:24 GMT
This is why I roll my eyes whenever someone suggests that Sansa is NOT the Younger & More Beautiful Queen because the North - and Westeros in general - will NEVER accept a woman as a queen in favor of her younger more "rightful" brothers. Like, ever. IT WILL NEVER CHANGE SO DON'T EVEN SUGGEST IT. I'm always like.... why are you so sure it WON'T change?? Why even tell this story at all if changes as major as that AREN'T possible?? How boring if, by the end of the series, ALL those patriarchal codes are still firmly in place? What would have been the whole point of this huge journey, especially by the female characters, to begin with if not to suggest that the entire society is experiencing a serious upheaval??
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Post by sillierthings on Apr 13, 2015 15:20:33 GMT
Here's a quotation from another GRRM book I'm reading at the moment:
While he's clearly referencing slavery in America here, I think GRRM is exploring the same themes in ASOIAF.
So, no, I don't see how readers can expect anything BUT a complete and total shift in society. I'm one note, I know, but for anyone who is agains SanSan, for example, because he's just not noble enough--do we really expect any of that to matter at the end of it all? I don't. For people who have these expansive theories about who can rightly be king or queen--again, I suspect anyone is fair game. Fire and blood are coming.
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Post by katie on Apr 13, 2015 16:34:55 GMT
It barely even matters now. Not to Sandor, not to Sansa, and certainly not to the North in general, as we were introduced to it. How utterly convenient that Sansa be reared in a place that puts a higher emphasis on deeds than titles, where men are not required to be knights in order to gain respect and prestige. How convenient that one of Sansa's most significant male relationships (and currently her ONLY "romantic" one) is with a man who refuses to take a knight's oath. The only reason I could see him NOT being accepted by the North is because of his past with the Lannisters, but I feel like he has more than proven his true loyalties. And if Sansa were to vouch for him, I think they would at least give him a chance.
So, really, whether the patriarchy falls or not, Sansa can be with Sandor if she so wishes, and there are few people who could or would stop her, I think. But even if the social upheaval does happen, it will make it all the more easier for them.
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