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Post by katie on Mar 6, 2015 19:36:11 GMT
Okay, I saw this post on the Tumblrs today about the BoBW that casually mentions something I had never considered before -- that Sandor possibly intended to mercy-kill Sansa when he came to her room that night!!! Now, I have always maintained that Sandor went there with the intention of comfort, some consensual sex (which was quickly abandoned), and whisking her away from KL like the gallant hero. And we know that he says to Arya that he should have ripped Sansa's heart out, but that was only after he found out she'd been married off to Tyrion... But what if that HAD been part of the plan?? Like, what if that was his Plan B? What if that was actually what he was intending after she "rejected" him and he pulled the knife on her?? What if he really DID think she would have been better off dead than leaving her there for Stannis's men?? (Remember, at the time, he believed the war to be lost) So, he was asking her to sing one last song for him before he put her down??? Omg, that throws that entire night into such a different, heartwrenching light!!! What do you guys think??? |
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Post by sillierthings on Mar 6, 2015 21:22:08 GMT
Okay, so I've thought about this, and while at first, I thought NO WAY!! He wanted love and sex! But now, I really think he was intending to mercy kill her. Killing is the sweetest thing there is, after all. Please keep in mind that this opinion is now strongly tainted with my thinking that Sandor is a nihilistic character along the lines of Merseult from the Stranger and Gregor Samsa from The Metamorphosis. I think initially, he had one last romantic fit. He passes out on her bed and wakes up to find her there, staring out the window "Little Bird! I knew you'd come!" Such a romantic statement in it's way. In his drunken terror, the little boy who stole a knight's toy is reborn for a moment. He's going to steal Joffrey's toy. He's going to rescue this fair maiden. He pulls her in for the kiss, drunk, pukey, bloody and terrifying. Sansa closes her eyes ("wanting it to be over"--curious language there. Was she wanting it to be over because she was terrified and he smelled bad. YES. Was she wanting it to be over because she kind of wanted that kiss on a subconscious level? I think the Unkiss points to YES, as well). At any rate, Ser "LOOK AT ME!!" sees her close her eyes and (obviously the man has never kissed anyone because that's WHAT YOU DO WHEN YOU KISS!!!) he thinks she'd never come away with him (though she might have if you'd ASKED Sandor!). So, he must know she's on her period--I suspect it's common knowledge, or at least Joffrey would know. She's a woman now. She's either going to belong to Joffrey, or if Stannis's men take over, she's either going to be bartered away or a victim of the rape and pillaging. He doesn't think she is going to come with him. He probably doesn't blame her, but in a way, how naive and stupid he must think she is. Doesn't she know what's waiting for her (no, she really doesn't)? So, he tells her to sing, to "sing for [her] little life." Chirp out those courtesies and optimistic hopes that he thinks are lies. Convince him that he shouldn't just slit her throat and spare her the misery of existence as Joffrey's wife or being raped by the soldiers. And she does. She sings that hymn and he cries, and he realizes that he is a #1 prize a-hole for even thinking of destroying that little bird and her song. She touches him and gives him her brand of mercy, mercy that need not come at the point of a dagger. And he leaves her to it. Leaves her maybe hoping that her song is true. That there is a better way, and then... ...he finds out that she was forced to marry the one man he seems to hate almost as much as Gregor. The nasty imp who gave his wife to be raped by an entire barracks. On his dying breath, he says he SHOULD have ripped her heart out, but he was an idiot, believing in her sweet song, and now look at where they all are. It's so sad  . |
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Post by katie on Mar 6, 2015 21:40:01 GMT
GAH. Yes, this is in line with what I was thinking too; I was asking myself, if he DID intend to kill her, then why did he really stop and leave her be? I'm thinking the same as you, that he felt the power of her song and her compassion and he couldn't bring himself to do it. It reminds me a little of The Green Mile when Edgecomb begins to have great misgivings about pulling the trigger on executing John Coffey, because he knows how special he is, that he's one of "god's gifts" to the world. I think Sandor may have been thinking this about Sansa as well. He couldn't destroy something so precious (not just to him, but to the world in general). But as you say, finding out that she was given to Tyrion, in his mind, shattered all his good intentions.
This doesn't, btw, eliminate every other predominant theory about what went down during the BoBW -- he STILL wanted the intimacy of that song, her compassion STILL broke him, he STILL tore off his cloak in disgrace -- this just adds another (extremely intense and heartwrenching) layer to it!
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Post by sillierthings on Mar 6, 2015 21:43:40 GMT
No, absolutely, there was still that element of affection, love, sex AND death all together. What a confusing, passionate mixture of emotions! No wonder Sansa is still hung up over it  . |
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Post by katie on Mar 6, 2015 21:52:31 GMT
As is Sandor... As are WE!!! LOL
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Post by sillierthings on Mar 6, 2015 22:08:43 GMT
I mean, really. If I am as hung up on this bloody, beautiful moment of death, passion, mercy and sex, can you imagine what Sansa and Sandor are going through ! |
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Post by katie on Mar 6, 2015 22:22:52 GMT
Heehee! Also, wanted to address this part as well:
Yes, I always loved that line. At first, you're like... "well DUH, it's HER ROOM", but in the greater context, it is Sandor's romanticized version of events that Sansa deliberately sought him out as he was waiting for her. She even mirrors that herself in her first ASOS chapter when she recalls "He had come to her in the darkness..."
Yes, I have always maintained that her closing her eyes wasn't so much a rejection as it was a submission (which is just as bad as far as Sandor is concerned), that she would have done the very same thing even if they were an acknowledged couple. No one wants to make out with the smelly drunk guy! And yes, in the "light of day", so to speak, Sansa's invention of the UnKiss acknowledges that she would not have minded the kiss after all if it had happened under better circumstances.
LOL! Yes, good point in that he must be seriously inexperienced if he honestly mistook her closing her eyes as a rejection. But he seems so quick to jump to those conclusions anyway with her, like when she says "I will sing it for you gladly" and he accuses her of being a liar, even though I think she was being perfectly sincere! He wants people to be honest with him, yet he can't accept it when that honesty is actually POSITIVE. Oh Sandor...
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Post by eyesofmist on Mar 7, 2015 1:17:16 GMT
This convo is really fascinating. The mystery of that scene makes us go back to it over and over because it is never clear what it means as there are so many layers to it. There is that subliminal layer that we have commented many times,the one that makes it look so sensual when there is no sex or sexual language. Not even the kiss is ever adressesed. Sansa feels he wants it but he never asks,only his body language gives him away,not his worlds or actual actions.
When I read it I felt the danger, it felt nearly terrifying when he had always been her protector, so it seemed really unnerving. In fact,I have never been sure what could have happened there. I think he needed to see her and then he thought of taking her with him. That comparison with stealing something from a monster, first from Gregor and now from Joff,is really spot on,sillier-things. He was trying to do just that and this shows once more that he is a true knight at heart. When he was a kid he wanted the toy knight and wanted to become a knight himself, now he wants the lady,the lady he had always wanted though he can't stand his own dreams and the bitter disappointment they have inmersed him in.
I also agree he has never kissed anyone before because he doesn't know how people react when they are about to be kissed. They say he visits brothels but he is no Tyrion, I can't imagine him paying a girl to pretend she wants to kiss him because that is more intimate and personal than a mindless fuck. It is heartbreaking to imagine that someone who has lived too much and felt to much, and faced so much horror, pain and death has never been kissed. It's really sad but I agree that he never has.
But did he mean to kill her when he thought he couldn't take her away from the city? I am still not sure,but he has a strange idea of what death means. He has suffered so much in his life that he thinks death is in itself an act of mercy. I think that's probably how he saw Mycah's death or why he wanted Bran to die quickly. He sees no hope and wants to save people some pain,he probably killed Mycah as a strange act of mercy, thinking Cersei would have been much more cruel to the boy if he was given to her. Perhaps he thought that it was kinder to do that. It makes sense,see how he killed that wounded soldier, tenderly,as if it was an act of love in a way.
As his idea of death is so twisted,deformed by his horrible past of abuse, torture and killing, perhaps he sees killing as an act of kindness and in this context it is possible that he thought of finishing Sansa off in a final act of kindness and mercy to her;death as an act of love, as terrible as it sounds.
Cersei told Sansa that ser Illyn would be there to kill them before the enemy forces reached them, ser Illyn he executioner,the image of death itself and Sansa prefers Sandor, someone who claims he is the butcher. Perhaps her opinion of him is better than the one he has of himself and she knows better than him that she can expect something better than death from this man.
I felt danger when reading this scene but it was so clear that it was an act of love from him, that she saw it as such too by the end,that I couldn't believe he could have killed her or rape her. However I felt the danger,it was palpable. Some people saw the scene as romantic,not me,not in the usual meaning we associate with the word,but it was very romantic in the haunting,dangerous pathetic way the Romanticism,the literary movement I mean,was romantic.
He is so damaged,so inmersed in a culture of death that perhaps he thought of finishing her life to save her more pain. Perhaps he thought that if he couldn't protect her, if she had to be left alone in the hands of complete monsters,she would be better off dead in a swift merciful way. Death as an act of love. It is possible, I think he could do something like that out of love,a terrible twisted idea of love, but love nevertheless.
Perhaps he was a bit like Arya and couldn't bring himself to kill her,I mean, she didn't deserve to die, just like Sandor didn't deserve to die by Arya's hand. It seemed better for both to die (she would be alone with enemies,without her family, without hope or protection and he was suffering in an unbearable way by the Triden) but the executioners (Sandor and Arya) were unable to deliver the gift of mercy.
In her Mercy chapter Arya thinks she should have finished Sandor off and Sandor thinks he sould have ripped Sansa's heart out because she was given to the dwarf he hated. I think there is parallelism between Arya and Sandor here,they are more similar than they think.
So, perhaps, as you say,that scene is so fascinating because it shows two people on the brink of falling into the abbys, falling into a vortex of desire, love,unbearable pain, horror and death. He wants her and she wants him but it can't be,or so he thinks because he can't believe anyone could want him. It isn't the right moment or the right place but he is about to have his first kiss and she wouldn't have denied him his wish. She responds to him out of instinct,without understanding everything consciously.
Do you think he meant to have sex with her before killing her? I don't think he would have raped her because that is something he hates,something Gregor does. What do you think?
And what would he have done if he had killed her, would he have killed himself too with that dagger, would they both have died together on that bed?
It sounds the darkest way of romantic. Can you imagine him going away after killing her or dying there by her side, perhaps holding her in a last embrace he never dared to have when they were alive?
Perhaps he came to her like an angel of death but she gave him hope, the hope he had lacked for years and that was the right song because he couldn't bring himself to kill her if there was hope. That's why he was devastated when he heard she had been married to Tyrion, so he wanted to die and seeked death in a reckless way, because she had showed him hope,love and a kinder way but all that was useless.
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Post by sillierthings on Mar 7, 2015 1:40:50 GMT
I like the way you've described it, "death as an act of love," because I truly think if he were planning to kill Sansa, and I think it's likely even if it wasn't a coherent thought, it would be because he did love her and did not want her to suffer at the hands of a monster. It's interesting when we see Tyrion kill Shae later, the woman he supposedly loves, for "betraying" him. I wonder if there are any parallels between these two scenes? I've never looked for them before...hmm... I go back and forth because so much is between the lines, but I don't think Sandor was consciously thinking of raping Sansa. The phallic dagger was there, and there is a sexual threat, but I cannot see him raping. Gregor is the rapist. Tyrion is a rapist. These are both men the Hound hates. I think he wanted Sansa. Again, how much of that was conscious? I don't know, but forcing her goes against everything he seems to want from her--look at him, listen to his stories, sing him a song--willingly. I mean, he weeps at the thought of forcing her to sing. I cannot imagine he consciously wanted to rape her. Maybe, at that moment, he was so much the Hound, he was at the greatest risk of doing such a thing, but she gentled him with her song and her touch. I agree that if he had killed Sansa, he would have killed himself. As you say, eyesofmist, darkly romantic--and not without precedent in the classic romances! He was a man with nothing to live for until she gave him that song, that hope...which is then horribly dashed. I can only imagine what The Gravedigger is going through now . |
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Post by katie on Mar 7, 2015 2:44:13 GMT
I think the whole notion of sex evaporated pretty quickly for him. When she asks what he's doing there, he says "You promised me a song, remember?" At this point, I think he was still using "song" as a metaphor for "sex", but I don't think he was still seriously considering it. So, he wasn't lying when he said that -- it IS what he came there for -- but I think as soon as she walked in the room, he knew he couldn't go through with it. She was still too young and too frightened, and there was no way, NO GODDAMN WAY, he was gonna rape her. Even if he killed her/himself afterwards, it would be the worst thing he could ever do and it would have been completely unpleasant. OH GOD OH GOD...  As much as it tears MY heart out, I think you're right; I don't think he could have just killed her and then scampered along on his merry way. He would literally not be able to live with himself. She was his last hope -- his last chance at honor (sound familiar? coughJAIME) -- but when she refused him (or so he thought), there was just nothing left for him. We see this mindset re-emerge after his options for selling off Arya dry up. She notes that he no longer seems to care about anything anymore. And why would he? And I believe that if Arya hadn't been Sansa's sister, he would literally have just dumped her off somewhere and went off on his own to drink himself to death. Oh man I am so depressed now, LOL.... |
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Post by eyesofmist on Mar 7, 2015 8:59:51 GMT
I'm not so sure he cried because he had forced her to sing and he suddenly was aware of how wrong this was, I think it's compemdium of many things. He can't take any more. Perhaps when he didn't know her he could take anything:torture,pain,humilination by the Lannisters,killing people mindlessly,a barren life where he hadn't even know what a kiss felt like... but now, now he couldn't take more because he had seen hope. Living a shitty life may be bearable when you haven't known anything else,but now he is in love and he knows she deserves to be loved and cherished and he can't be the one to give her that although he is dying to do just that,he wants just that with all his heart.
He has glimpsed what life could be and that he doesn't stand any chances. I guess he was somewhat happy,albeit for intermittent moments,while they were together in KL. Talking to her, stealing glances at her,having her listening to his stories, as you said,making him feel a man and not a dog, I think that was the closest to happiness that he ever was after Gregor maimed him. If we add that he had to leave her at the hands of monsters,to leave her, the real lady and not a pretender (as she was the real thing )and that she was going to be destroyed and there was nothing he could do to help her,not even giving her the gift of mercy,we can understand why he cried.
Did he start crying when the idea of killing her crossed his mind,or perhaps when he realised he couldn't do it?
When people analyse Sandor's words saying he should have fucked bloody before leaving her for the dwarf they pay too much attention to the fucking bloody part and too little to to the ripping her heart out part but perhaps that is the wrong approach because that scene was more about death than sex (despite the evident presece of sexual imagery and even a symbolic bedding).
He offered to save her,to take her away with him, but not even himself believed she would accept, and this is shocking,because in her situation it seemed better than staying there. Perhaps he thought it was better to kill her then and later in his deathbed he regretted not doing that,but I'm not sure because by then he already knew she had escaped.
Another thing is that I've never believed there are two personas in him,that he is the Hound when he does despicable things. I think he is always the same person but the hound is a pose. Give them what they want,appear a monster if this is what they think anyway, I guess this is what he does but he is consistent with his actions. He is never a monster and never gets joy from killing,except perhaps when he saves people some more pain.
I don't believe in his redemption arch and never did, in fact I dislike the idea although it may sound strange to some. I dislike the idea because who has the right to judge another deserving of redemption? Only God if you are religious but not other men that in Sandor's case, are usually far worse than him but very hypocritical. Deep inside he is a decent human being, so what he needs is healing and rediscovering who he initially was and has been all the time but could never afford to live accordingly.
There is something I don't belive either, I don't believe she calmed him down with that song as if he was a feral dog, I think she showed him an open window in the prison his life felt like, she showed him hope and that is why he cried. She was all he had ever dreamed of and then some more and she could never be his, what's more, she would belong to a monster that would hurt her.
Many readers like to think that Sansa has changed the Hound,that the power of love has changed him but this is not how I see it, I think he has a strong personality and does what he thinks he must do and not what a good woman makes him do.
This trope appears in too many stories and it isn't something I like. A woman doesn't change a man but she can give him a reason to live and this is what Sansa does. For the fist time in years Sandor had a reason to live when he met her and everybody needs a reason to live. She gave him respect and humanity, and even affection but I think he was already decent deep down. He was good to her as a reaction to the way she treated him but he already had it in him to be a good man,Sansa didn't make a miracle.
And how could Sansa calm a grown man that was beyond himself when she was utterly terrified herself? As I see it, he saw her for what she was and acted accordingly. I believe in his capacity to decide when he sees an open door,perhaps loving her makes him look for an open door he never saw before as he had given up hope so long ago.
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Post by eyesofmist on Mar 7, 2015 10:41:33 GMT
Do you think he went there with the idea of having consensual sex(because I agree that he is not a rapist)among other things? I tend to think that he didn't have that intention intially, but of course I can't be sure  . I think he went there acting the dashing knight to the rescue,that he went there to save his lady and steal Joff's toy mirroring that action that cost him half his face and much more in the past. This has made me think that perhaps he didn't leave the battle for fear. He lead several sorties and boarded at least an enemy ship in a really heroic way after all.The description we get from Davos is just epic. I don't think anybody in the series is described in so many epic actions as Sandor,perhaps Jaime a couple of times,but that scene where he boards a burning ship riding his horse with his cloak streaming back is pure epic glory. We know he fears fire but he can face it, he also beat Dondarrion who was fighting him with a flaming sword, Sandor is afraid of fire but he faces it. I think he just felt he had had enough and decided to leave all that useless shit and try to save the lady and get the fuck out of that blasted city. So he went there in his broken version of a knight in a song but with the same intentions and the same courage. I don't think sex was included in his mind because that's not what a true knight would do. On, but he tried to have that kiss because knights do get a kiss from their ladies when they save them, they always do. The problem is that he was acting out a story,that of the true knight and the fair maiden and reality doesn't play as beautifully as a story. So he doesn't have the beauty or the shining armour, he doesn't smell nice and the girl closes her eyes. Poor Sandor,all girls close their eyes when you kiss them, you silly thing, but how could you know? This breaks my heart every time we comment it but I'm sure he never enjoyed a girl's kiss in his thirty years of life and you have explained it very well. No one who has kissed before thinks the other person rejects the kiss when they close their eyes;on the contrary,they would see this as a sign of acceptance. Well, I don't think sex can be included in this role-playing game they have, the true knight won't have the lady until they are betrothed or something. What I mean is that the scene is written as a twisted version of the typical rescue scene. You even have it in Star Wars when Han Solo opens Leia's cell and lets her out. Han acts like a hero but he is a rogue,and Leia doesn't say thank you or kiss him,like in a fairy tale. Even Fiona wanted to see her knight's face when Shreck rescued her,she probably wanted a kiss from him,the problem was that he was an ogre, but was it really problem? LOL. Here we have the knight and the lady too and he wants to live his own story,his own song, with her but the bubble pops when he feels rejected. All the sexual imagery is present because he wants her so badly but he can only play out that sexual (and not only sexual) desire in a shocking ritual dance of death. The dagger is at her throat but the words are incredibly erotic. George is using words that sound erotic because they are. If you focus on they words in bold it seems they are having sex, but the author is using this words in a ritual of death instead of one of love making. This goes well if you read the scene as an act of love that is consumated by death instead of sex and this is probably what is going on in that room, on that bed. If he can't save her by taking her away he will save her by taking her life. He couldn't bear her death by his hand, so I truly believe he would have killed himself too and die next to her on that bed,together in bed at last, since they couldn't lie together in life. But Sansa chose life for both of them,she saved her life and his with that song, showing him the way out he couldn't see for himself. I guess he didn't believe in a way out for him because he was drinking himself to death when he was caught in the Riverlands but he left Sansa in KL because he respected her hope and her desire not to give up. Later Arya becomes his reason to live for, as if she was a daughter he had to look after. As if he had lost his lover but still had their daughter and he had to look after the kid. Broken as he was he cared for Arya, which shows he could make a good father if given the chance. |
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Post by katie on Mar 7, 2015 17:05:41 GMT
Well, the sex thing, for me, goes along with his state of mind when he abandoned the battle. I believe he was certainly having some sort of PTSD breakdown (it certainly wouldn't be the last time -- even after his fight with Beric, he suddenly dissolves into a weeping puddle of traumatized child); fire is one thing, but wildfire is something completely different, and I think it's safe to say that it's something Sandor had never encountered before. I'm sure fighting amongst infernos was not new to him, but what WAS new to him in that situation was the fact that *someone* had made him realize that he wasn't just a robot that was obligated to throw himself back into the flames that terrify him. For the first time, he realized that he wasn't just a "dog" that had to do his duty for people he hated; he was man with opinions and feelings and they MATTERED just as much as anyone else's. So when he found himself afraid (yet again), it just wasn't worth it to keep going at that point. And so he left it behind and sought out the one person who would understand what he was going through.
Unfortunately, trauma and booze don't mix, LOL. I think he DID intend to have consensual sex with her, I think it DID cross his mind at a certain point, because I think in his drunken, fucked up state of mind, he might have thought that was an actual possibility. He knew he needed comfort, and being as emotionally immature as he is, comfort from a woman = sex, so that's why I think his mind went there. But like I said, once he was actually there and in the moment with her, he snapped out it. Much like he did when he commented on her maturing body on the Serpentine Steps. He found his mind wandering to lewd places, but then he checked himself because he knew it wasn't right.
This also ties in to one's interpretation of his confession to Arya:
For me, those parts in bold are all clearly one continuous thought. He meant to take HER as well as the song, he SHOULD have, in fact he should have fucked her brains out and then killed her. I don't buy the idea that he is telling Arya that he should have rescued her from KL, because this is his moment to confess his MISdeeds, not his intended heroic ones. Yes, he did try to take her out of KL too, we know that, but that isn't what he's trying to get across here. He's confessing his sins, he's trying to provoke Arya to kill him, he already admitted that the song was taken by force, so why would he immediately follow that up with a (irrelevant) mention of his good intentions? No, he is confessing the "sin" of wanting to claim the maidenhood of a young girl. For him, that's almost as bad as having actually done the deed.
That's just my opinion, though, I know a lot of people don't share it, LOL. If you're of the opinion that (a) he was not suffering a mental breakdown the night of the BoBW and/or (b) his confession referred to rescue as opposed to sex, then I can see how his intentions in Sansa's bedchamber would look wildly different.
GRRM may choose to elucidate this in a future book, so I could be completely wrong of course, but until then, this is what makes sense in my own mind given the information that we have. ;-)
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Post by eyesofmist on Mar 7, 2015 23:35:18 GMT
But I agree that he is talking about sex here. I also think he meant to take her with him because he didn't want only her maidenhead but having her for himself, as his woman. What I am not sure about is whether the idea of shagging her really crossed his mind that night despite how much he wanted her.
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Post by eyesofmist on Mar 8, 2015 17:08:12 GMT
I have been thinking about this scene over and over. When I first read it first was obscure and ambiguous and I was expecting something else to happen, I even thougth that perhaps there had been sex in that room because there was a silent pause where nothing seemed to happend and then she rose from that bed, took his cloak and wrapped herself in it,and then she stayend on the floor instead of going that to the bed. The cloak was stained and smelly, why did she prefer that cloak to the blankets on her bed if she was cold. Why did she wrap herself in a cloak that belonged to the man who had just threated her life and made her sing with a dagger at her throat?
Why did he come? Why did he desert after putting up with so much shit?
Why didn't she take her with him if she never said no to his offer?
Why does George make Sandor threaten Sansa with a dagger if he is so strong and could killed with his bare hands if that was his intention?
Did he ever intend to kill her and why?
Did the idea of rape ever cross his mind?
Did the idea of having consensual sex with such a young girl ever cross his mind,if for brief moment?
On my first read I was scared and I didn't like the scene one bit, I mean, I liked it very much from the literary point of view but I wasn't nice,it belong in a gothic novel where the monster(or the evil man)loves the girl but it is in his nature to destroy her and himself too,because he will kill all his humanity in the process. And what about the sexual threat he posed for her? That scared me too,thanks good there was no sex between them because even if it was consensual it would be unforgivable and none of them could have got over it
I know there was a very real sexual threat, I know it,but I don't know if the danger I felt was just his overhelming desire-all his passions were burning and he felt like an open wound-or if he really meant to have her in that way. I never thought he really meant to kill her until your suggested that mercy-killing could have been his intention when he thought she didn't want to leave. It makes sense considering the circumstances and how he sees death. I think he felt like an angel of death until he met her and saw killing as an act of mercy. Gregor didn't kill him but he condemned Sandor to a life of suffering,so he doesn't rape and he kills in the most efficient way,clean and fast.
Killing her and commiting suicide with the same dagger makes sense,it would have been a good ending for them making them the topic for one of those tragic love songs they both liked. He would't take her maidenhead but would take her life and we know he can do that as sweetly as others make love.
This is no sublimation of death, it is not my intention to make killing sound poetic,but it could be a good interpretation of what Sandor is like and what that scene between Sansa and him meant. In the scene above Aryan doesn't take his meaning,she says this is only one of the ways how you can kill a man but I am afraid his meaning is much deeper than that.
The parts in bold make one think of crying,the water through the helm's eyeholds suggests the Hound is crying and this is not the first time,because when he killed Mycah his eyes were too bright, was he crying then? It is possible. If he really intended to kill Sansa when they were lying on her bed,then he would be crying again at the thought again.
It does make sense, he might have thought of mercy-killing her but I am not sure he thought of killing her. I wouldn't be surprised if that was on his mind in that scene,though. Threre are too many possible readings for this scene and I am never sure which is the correct one. It is making me crazy.
What about him killing the butcher's boy? I think it was a breaking point for him, the butcher killing the butchers boy. It was like the point of no return where Sandor would lose all his humanity and turn into a mindless killing machine,it's as if he killed himself when he killed that kid, as if he killed the boy he was once. If it wasn't for Sansa he would be lost for ever.
He probably run very fast when he run away from Cleagene keep and he did run fast enough. He probably thought of himself when he killed that poor kid. At the same age Sandor killed his first man and decided to be a butcher instead of a victim.
Are you sure he intended to mercy-kill Sansa or do you have doubts,like me? That scene is making me crazy and it always has.
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As much as it tears MY heart out, I think you're right; I don't think he could have just killed her and then scampered along on his merry way. He would literally not be able to live with himself. She was his last hope -- his last chance at honor (sound familiar? coughJAIME) -- but when she refused him (or so he thought), there was just nothing left for him. We see this mindset re-emerge after his options for selling off Arya dry up. She notes that he no longer seems to care about anything anymore. And why would he? And I believe that if Arya hadn't been Sansa's sister, he would literally have just dumped her off somewhere and went off on his own to drink himself to death. Oh man I am so depressed now, LOL....
. I think he went there acting the dashing knight to the rescue,that he went there to save his lady and steal Joff's toy mirroring that action that cost him half his face and much more in the past. This has made me think that perhaps he didn't leave the battle for fear. He lead several sorties and boarded at least an enemy ship in a really heroic way after all.The description we get from Davos is just epic. I don't think anybody in the series is described in so many epic actions as Sandor,perhaps Jaime a couple of times,but that scene where he boards a burning ship riding his horse with his cloak streaming back is pure epic glory.