|
Post by sillierthings on Apr 15, 2015 15:24:25 GMT
Good catch with the description of his eyes as "sullen," which has a connotation of resentment to me, he's brooding about something. And that's another word used to describe the Hound in both Sansa and Arya's chapters: brooding. Brooding suggests a preoccupation with a painful or disturbing thought. I'm also going to go too far, but here we go--brooding is directly related to they way a hen hovers over her eggs when she's trying to hatch them. If you are brooding over your thoughts, you are hovering over them like a mother chicken. I remember from lit classes, particularly Milton, used the word brooding to describe the way creation itself takes place, God brooding over the earth until it's hatched. It's a negative description on the one hand, but brooding also suggests that something is going to come of it. Someone is thinking hard, looking for an answer, perhaps.
And then we find out about his brother. I know I'm probably slow on the uptake, but it took me a while to realize that Gregor just is not around Sandor that often. Sandor lives at court in King's Landing, and Gregor does his own thing as Lord Clegane off near Casterly Rock somewhere. So, not only is he having to deal with Gregor on his turf, but because of the way things went in the tourney, Sandor is likely to have to face his brother in a joust--and as we see from the conversation that follows, Gregor plays dirty. He might have to kill his brother tomorrow because his brother might try to kill him, and he's scared and angry and here's this stupid, little bird chirping at him, the one who has been staring at him all along the Kingsroad, and he spills everything.
Sansa doesn't ruminate on this much beyond that "somehow, the fear had gone away," but she gets it. Gets it so clearly all she has to say to Sandor is "he was no true knight." That sums it all up doesn't it? It's such a little phrase, but it shows how deeply she gets what's hurting him.
To tie this back to Harry, I've seen on other boards that there is some speculation that Harry may be set up to die in the tourney at the Gates of the Moon. This would have an interesting symmetry to it since Sansa and the Hounds first real conversation starts with a discussion of how Gregor killed Ser Hugh of the Vale, Jon Arryn's squire (I think?), in the tourney of the Hand. Is another Arryn man set to die at someone's orders?
|
|
|
Post by sillierthings on Apr 15, 2015 17:06:41 GMT
By the way, not that this is terribly on topic, but did you notice how Sansa very casually insults Littlefinger's looks? Or maybe just his style:
Sansa doesn't seem to think much of that "little pointy" devil beard.
And by the way, Sansa is starting to get that innuendo. Is "joust" the male equivalent of a "song"? You know who is a really good jouster? You know who won the Hand's tourney. Sandor Clegane. And he's good at talking too, tells a very good story.
|
|
|
Post by katie on Apr 15, 2015 17:30:56 GMT
Yeah, like I pointed out in a recent Tumblr post, Sansa doesn't seem to think much of LF at all. She thinks about how he never helped her while she was still in King's Landing, she thinks about how he seems like two different people, she thinks ("miserably") about how he is her only friend in the world, and that's about it. She never comments much on his looks nor does she seem interested in figuring him out as a person or trying to see things from his perspective. She is utterly detached from him. Even under the father-daughter ruse, she seems unable to muster up even an iota of fondness for him. If he fell off a cliff tomorrow, she'd probably have about 5 seconds of "Oh, isn't that a shame?" before turning right around and going on her merry way as if he had never even existed. He means NOTHING to her.
|
|
|
Post by eyesofmist on Apr 15, 2015 20:22:32 GMT
She is sad for him but the word pity is not mentioned,because pity,as she said herself about Tyrion,is the death of desire.So she can feel sad for him but never says she pities him,because she will come to desire this man. In a way,she is probably already fascinated by him if she's been glancing at him all the way down to KL,as he said.
I agree that she took in every single detail in his attire,his stance,nothing escaped her scrutiny. And when a woman can describe a man in such a detailed way it means something. She doesn't describe other men with so much detail. She also pays attention to parts of his body that reflect virility more than others ,without being bawdy like Randa, lol, but she does. No dimples and no teeth but look at those hand resting his belt,and those shoulders. Both men and women alike can have nice dimples and teeth but hands are very different in men and women. Men's hands are something I really love,but I only look at them with special attention when I find the man attractive,if not, I don't notice. But Sansa is looking at his hands,where they are resting and she probably nitices his flat stomch and his waist because they are resting on his belt. Not any belt but a sword belt,which is really manly,like his leather jerkin. Boys in leather are sexy,aren't they,sexy and a bit wild and dangerous.That's the idea. Padded doublets are for softies,leather is for bad boys,LOL.
And the broad shoulders,that's a very virile trait too and they must be broad in this case as he is so fit and tall. That's the kind of thing that shows she is attracted to him. There are many things she could have noticed about him and she foculses on his martial stand,his hands and his broad shoulders. If he was any other and not the hound I'd have thought she is checking him out, that's why Martin gave that horrible initial impression of him so that he could hide this better, so well that many keep refusing to see it.
|
|
|
Post by eyesofmist on Apr 17, 2015 7:08:47 GMT
Yesterday I saw a chapter of the series Vikings, which I have enjoyed very much so far, and a young girl like Sansa was married to an old ugly guy. She tried to look for something nice to say when her future husband gave her a ring and you could see her forced smile and how she tried to think of something to say to him. The only nice word she could think of for a man she didn't want was "kind".
I also wonder why so many fans are angry at a beautiful girl for not wanting a man who happens to be ugly and little whereas Tyrion doesn't want Peny or any other woman who is less than beautiful and everyone thinks this is understandable and fine. 'You are very kind, my lord' she said."
kindness is not something you associate to a man you're attracted to, even if he is kind. Sansa thinks of kindness associated to Tyrion and cruel kisses associated to Sandor. I think it' s pretty obvious she feels attracted to one of these men and it is not Tyrion.
|
|
|
Post by sillierthings on Apr 17, 2015 13:38:08 GMT
This is a very good example. I was thinking about this because on the one hand, don't you want your husband/lover to be kind? I can see how people could look at Sansa's comment and think that there is hope for a Tyrion/Sansa relationship. However, rarely do I think that is the first character trait you think of when you are finding someone desirable. Besides, Sansa's definition of kind is extraordinarily generous. Tyrion was "kind" because he did not force her to have sex with him after their forced marriage. Though he remained married to her. She was forced to sleep in the same bed as him. "Kind" is not quite the word I would use, but there you go.
I like to think of the phrase "cruel to be kind" in this situation. Sandor's mouth may be cruel, but what is cruel about it? The way he kisses? Is it painful? Forceful? Or is it the words that come out of his mouth--cruel, nihilistic, harsh words that make her wake up to her situation. She likes that about him though. He's cruel, but he's truthful. There is something to be admired in that and Sansa does. More than that, whatever we readers may think of the word cruel, it's canon in GRRM's novels that a young girl, Dany, who wanted a man, Daario, in a very passionate way, imagined his kisses to be cruel in her fantasies. Jorah, faithful Jorah, was kind to her. And she doesn't want Jorah in that way.
|
|
|
Post by katie on Apr 17, 2015 17:07:00 GMT
This is why I love Martin's writing so much. And also why I am so glad I already knew what was coming so that I could catch all those fun little parallels in other characters' chapters, such as the "cruel" kisses that Dany fantasizes about that you mention. You really do have to pay attention to EVERYTHING, because GRRM could very well be clarifying something from one character's chapter in a completely different character's chapter. Makes it more fun. ;-)
|
|